Beginner becoming more aware of the quality of the paints I use

As is always the case ,use the best you can afford and you cant go wrong . You get what you pay for . Student colours serve the beginner very well and after a while you feel you need the better quality paints......Syd

This ties in a little to a post I was going to make about going overboard spending on artists materials. I find not a week goes by that I don't buy several items, and whilst good quality paints are arguably worth the extra I think it is pretty easy to get carried away... my postman commented to me "Everyday must be christmas in your house" because not a day goes by where I don't seem to be signing for something. Last night I bought a pencil case (in case I find myself going to museums to sketch their exhibits) some waterproof fine-liners, some water colours, some Japanese calligraphy brushes and some fixative spray all just on a whim... this could become a seriously expensive hobby.

FAAHHSANDS of years ago - well; around 50 - when I first began painting, an artist of my acquaintance suggested I use student quality paints to start with - and I sort of still agree with that, when you're really starting out - ie, in your first few months, assuming you're painting every day or every week. But you know already, I'm sure, that if you use second-class brushes, paper, or colours, your wallet might be heavier at the end of the day but they will hold you back if you stick to them and don't splash a bit of cash towards your equipment. I've heard several opinions of the SAA's colours - and have used some of them myself. I think they're perfectly good for most applications, but -- or not even 'but', just 'and' - they don't always use standard mixes, but employ different pigments to make up some of their colours. Eg, while the recipe might have changed since I last looked, their Rose Madder isn't made from the same basic ingredients (Pigment number) as many other makers. This doesn't necessarily make it worse, but it does make it different. Without going to their website, I don't know what's in their Light Red - I'll take a look later - but it should be a rich, opaque earth red, not a transparent colour. If it's the latter, it won't make the mixes that the more commonly used pigments will make. This is why, if you're interested in comparing pigments and finding out which best suit you, it's important to know the Pigment Number, which you can find explained on the Handprint website, and a few others (it would help if someone who can remember what they're talking about, which I can't at times, would post a link!). You mention Cobalt Blue, as well - is the SAA colour a genuine Cobalt, or a Hue? If the latter, it will never give you the strength that you'll get from the real thing. There are some pigments that I would always buy from the best ranges I could get: W & N being one. These include all the metallic colours: Cobalt Blue, Cerulean Blue (you wouldn't guess from the name that it's a metal, but it is), Cadmium Yellow, Lemon, Red, Orange. A colour I'm very fond of is a red called Winsor Red, which isn't as expensive as Cad Red - but worth having since it leans both ways as it were - towards blue/purple and towards the more orange side of the spectrum. If you want high quality paint at relatively modest cost, I'd take a look at the ranges offered by Jacksons and Ken Bromley's, i.e. their own range of paints; or - at slightly less modest cost - from Michael Willcox's School of Colour (good value in all of these cases because they offer a lot of paint in the tube). Winsor and Newton, and Daler Rowney Artists/Professional quality paints are well worth their price - you just don't have to use so much paint to get a good coverage and strength. So, long answer to a simple question, but you say you're improving, you can see a real difference between your early work and your latest - time to spend some money. Get yourself some good paper - as you have: you might find your synthetic brushes are fine, we don't all use sables, but once you weaken I fear you won't look back; and yes - it's time for you to try other, premium brands of paint. You might still love your SAA paints - many do. But introduce a few more concentrated colours to your palette gradually and affordably, and see what you can do with them. Finally (takes a time, dunnit?) as a veteran of this website, I bet someone will be itching to come in and say 'forget all that, what's wrong with Cotman?': well, there's NOTHING wrong with Cotman; many a good picture has been painted with Cotman paints, and perhaps still more have benefited from the use of Cotman brushes; but it is a cheaper grade of paint, and it's not what your question was about. So Cotman-ites, and SAA lovers, restrain yourselves ....

Daveyboyz - if you paint in watercolour, acrylic AND oil, yes - it can be blinking expensive! I have to ration myself, but then I used to sell work, and still do now and then, which helps.... I'm sure you could, too. I suppose, though - any pastime, hobby, all-consuming interest, maybe other than collecting conkers, is going to swallow the coinage.... thing is, is it worth it? I should be surprised if you weren't reaching the point I arrived at years ago - just can't do without it in our lives. So, sigh.... we find the money somehow. But if you're also saying that you don't need to go overboard on every latest arty gimmick, I couldn't agree more; get the best you can, but don't let yourself get seduced by the very latest must-have.

My dream is to find a paint that produces pictures all by itself - I haven't tried Daniel Smith, but had noticed the price.... which deterred me somewhat. Still - armed with Ellen's encouragement..... the Ken Bromley catalogue arrived this morning, and I think they do Daniel Smith W/colours too. I've run my stocks of paper, canvas/boards, paint right down - I've even run out of sketchbooks: vast expenditure looms - pity the electricity bill has arrived..........

I am not sure about selling, on the one hand it would be nice to claw some money back but I am full of self doubt about the quality of what I am producing and wouldn't know where to start regarding pricing and promoting my work. Using acrylics I have one little set of tubes (12 ML each) but have fallen into a limited pallet. White and Black I have large tubs (which I seem to have made significant dents in) I have Burnt Sienna, Pyrrole Red, Ultramarine blue, Lemon Yellow and a tube of Cyan in the 75ML Daler Rowney tubes and these seem capable of covering every base. How necessary is it to have lots of colours? Perhaps a liability for us inexperienced types as a limited pallet is more likely to produce a harmonious painting? Am I missing out in this respect? Concerning water colours is there more need for a larger array of colours? Is the quality of some mediums more important than other mediums?

DaveyB - I think your approach is sound: I don't have a huge palette of colours myself, although I do vary my basic set a bit now and then. I'm not even sure if that's entirely necessary - you can vary colour so much in the mixing anyway that a huge range of colours is just an expensive short-cut. Though one of our old (in experience) members, Phil Kendall, who isn't posting here at the moment, certainly believes in a large palette for his acrylics, and uses it very effectively. I don't think that the medium you use has all that much influence on the palette, though as it happens I tend to use fewer colours in watercolour and acrylic than I do in oil: wish I knew why, really - probably just that I started in oils, and discovered the potential of a lot of colours on the way. But - many speak of the advantages of the limited palette, and there's certainly no point in loading yourself with colours that you could just as easily mix. (Though the aforementioned Phil would probably disagree - because of purity of colour considerations.) As in all things - go your own way (which I fully expect you will..).

I started out watercolour painting using Cotman, but quickly moved on to the artist quality brands, mainly W&N and Daler Rowney. I also buy Daniel Smith which has a fantastic, if somewhat expensive, range of colours, but it's easy to fall into the trap of buying attractive colours which sit unused - I have too many of these! - but unless you're doing large scale paintings, good artist quality paints are always the best option. Ken Bromley sells all these brands at discounted prices and their service is excellent. some colour

My approach in watercolour was to use the artist quality colours from well known manufacturers without going to the most expensive like Daniel Smith until the result justified the expense. However the one thing I never economised on was paper, poor paper will almost inevitably prejudice the end result.

I haven't thought about this until now I'm using a Daler + Rowney set of graduate acrylics I bought from the local art shop for £20 which contains all the primary colors 220ml tubes and I'm happy with them, I don't know if this makes good quality or not, but I seem to be able to get the colors I want. when I think about spending stupid amounts of money on paint knowing myself, knowing the paint cost me so much it'd probably effect my art expression in a negative way because I'd be constantly worrying about how much paint the over priced stuff cost and the risk of wasting it! there's some great video's on youtube about how to make great quality oil paint with better pigments than the mass produced stuff even the likes of Windsor + Newtom make. The 1 thing I do regard as essential is a good quality brush.

when I started painting watercolour many years ago, as a student I was recommended and bought student grade paint. with my own students I recommend 4 tubes of artist quality paint and build from there. artist quality will last longer and higher concentration of pigment. the reason students are always buying new paint is because you need a lot more student paint to do the same job! 4 tubes of paint costs the same as a set of 20 nasty ones!! :)