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The Perch Pond ( I think)
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Message
Posted
I know, that's a weird title. There are six angling ponds near my house but only three seem to have names and I'm not sure if this one actually IS the Perch Pond. I stopped an auld fella the other day, as he was walking his dog, and asked him if he knew the names of all the ponds. We had a good chat and he eventually said "I don't know what this one's called but it's bloody beautiful". LOL He then went on to describe how the sun affects the view enormously, which was great to hear. They're old mill ponds btw, now part of a nature reserve.
This is an acrylic underpainting for an oil, 50 x 40 cms. I started with a few pencil markers, not a drawing so much as pointers for perspective and composition. Then, because of the number of trees standing in a row I used different colours to show where each tree should be. This was followed by the acrylics. In total I've already spent about two hours just to get to this stage, but it's been nice to see it develop. I'll be adding clouds and overhanging branches as I go, even a few coots (maybe) and will post some of the photos too, to show you the possibilities. Please, please feel free to comment/critique as I go. Nothing, or very little, of the painting below will be visible when I'm finished.
Posted
Looking good - and if you want to learn if it's the perch pond or not, take your little fishing rod down there and wait until you land one; making sure it's not a pike.
This isn't a criticism, each to their own way of working, but I wonder why you do your underpainting in acrylic - provided you're working on a rigid surface and not painting too thickly, it shouldn't cause any problems, but are you maybe a bit less than confident about going straight in with the oils? If so - there's only one way to gain that confidence, and that's to pile in (with the oil paint, not into the pond). You could use alkyds instead, or just thin oil paint, and start and finish with the same medium.
But - just because that's what I like to do is no reason why you should, if you're happier painting the base sketch with acrylic first; it's just that it seems to me you have a lovely blue there, and it's a bit of a pity to cover it up, among other things. Anyway - I like what you've got so far, and look forward to seeing the finished result.
Posted
Thank you very much, Marjorie, Robert and Sylvia, for the very helpful and supportive comments.
Isn't that the strangest thing? I posted this for the very reason you've all cited. I thought it seemed a shame to lose all of this by covering it with oils. However, I've been here before and usually, not always, prefer the finished oil painting. A part of me wants to use a couple of decent acrylics, (cheaper ones used for this) to finish the trees and then simply leave it. OR paint another similar one using just oils.
Ah, interesting points, Robert, and many thanks for your usual sage advice and recommendations. The main reason I use acrylics for an underpainting, is to help prevent dull spots or excessive oil loss (sinking in) from the upper layers. I've tried oiling out if the problem looks troublesome but it never seems to work for me, often leaving a tacky result. I read that smooth thinned acrylic, not too thin, creates an effective solution to sinking in by providing a suitable barrier. The watered acrylic acts in much the same way as gesso, as it dries to a matte finish and leaves thousands of micro-holes for purchase. So I usually apply a thin layer of watered acrylic to a pre-prepared canvas before painting with oils. I extend this, sometimes, into an acrylic painting to get the feel for the composition, given the drying time of acrylic over oils. Mostly, I paint a very rough underpainting, but with this one I was more careful, leaving myself with a dilemma. LOL
I have my colours planned, in my head, so I'll see where I end up. No rude comments, please. *smile*
Best to all
Bri
Posted
Thanks for the "sinking in" tip, Marjorie. The only time I get dull spots now is when I add a glaze, so I tend to fatten them up a bit.
Pleased the painting's heading in the right direction. Thanks for that.
I've been working on this, on and off, this afternoon and it's ready for the foreground and coots (still not sure about them). I'll leave this until tomorrow before adding any more. I'm off to watch Strictly and X-Factor.
I've had to photograph this from the side because the wet paint was causing a lot of glare. Should give you an idea where it's going, though.
Managed to get a better photo this morning, now that the paint has dried a bit. It's a tad blurry, but not terribly so. Now for the foreground etc.
Posted
I see your point about sinking-in - and oiling out isn't always such a great idea, because it does tend to increase yellowing. But as I already had made the same point, I echo Marjorie's about alkyds.
But that's not what you've done this time, you might do it one of these days; and the picture is coming along beautifully.
On a general point, sinking-in is common with Burnt Umber, but if it's happening with glazes I'd be inclined to apply them with Stand Oil (aka 'bodied oil') rather than, say, Liquin. Sinking-in doesn't bother me, because I know that the final varnish will render it unnoticeable - and for whatever reason, I don't seem to suffer from it much..... I wonder if Alan Bickley, who paints in oil a lot more than I currently do, has a view about this?
Posted
I've always got a view Robert as you know!, some not always welcome...
But I'm not sure that I can be of much help to Brian on this issue. The only benefit that I can see in working with acrylics as an underpainting is drying time. it's not a practice that I particularly like either, and I quite often like some of my underpainting to show through, and of course I wouldn't want an acrylic base showing. I don't have any issues with sinking-in either.
I build up my painting in layers these days (unless it's a quick oil sketch at the scene), using distilled turpentine initially and painting thinly - this layer will dry sufficiently in an hour generally, give or take. For the final couple of layers I have a mix of distilled turps and stand oil, 60/40 in ratio. This gives me a reasonable sheen to the finished piece, although I do varnish this at a later date (unless it's sold beforehand of course).
I tend to work on a minimum of two paintings in my studio, often three. This way I have no drying time issues, a common practice by many artist's. I had a WIP feature in the e-newsletter last week, you can see my working practice in that, which may help to explain better.
Coming along nicely anyway Brian, it does need a little something in the foreground as you say, and well done with those greens.
Posted
Thank you very much, Robert and Alan, for the excellent feedback. I've never used alkyds before but I'll definitely give them a run out.
I've read a few articles since receiving your advice and it all looks exactly what I've been looking for. I always leave the acrylics overnight
before progressing onto the oils so I should be ok with alkyd paint or medium. Nothing ventured! *smile*
I've finished the painting and will post an update soon.
Thanks again for the generous advice and explanations. Very good of you.
Bri
PS
Robert, I meant to say after your first post that I haven't got a fishing rod. LOL
A title change could well be in order.
B
Edited
by Beemax
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