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Turps v OMS
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Message
Posted
Hello all, I've always used OMS, but as I've only been painting in oils for a year I'm still learning about and trying out different things.
I love the look of juicy paint on the canvas/board but am struggling to create it. I use only the tiniest touch of OMS, when plein air painting, but the paintings can still look thin and they sometimes sink.
My question is:
When you use turps instead of odourless mineral spirits in a painting, does it have an effect on the final result, i.e. does it help maintain that lovely juicy look of oils?
Posted
Using solvent on its own, whatever it is, will make the paint thinner and more dry. Use it for the first lay-out, then use a mix of solvent and oil for passages which won't flow without it. You could try Winsor and Newton oil painting medium, the biggest problem with which is that I can't get the safety cap off; and there are others.
Mineral spirits, aka White Spirit, is useless for painting as it sucks all the life out of paint, and stinks. I'm not entirely sure what OMS is - I gather it's a mineral spirit solvent, but what the O stands for I don't know.
There are spirits which are probably technically better with oil paint because of their resinous nature - one of these is Turpentine (downside: the fumes), another is Oil of Spike.
My own practice varies - I've used a half and half mix of low odour thinners, or Turpentine, with Linseed oil; and that's still a sound medium. there's also Liquin, which some like. And you can mix Turps and Stand Oil (thickened Linseed oil, which looks a bit like treacle). If you use too little oil, or too much spirit solvent, the paint will be "underbound" - lifeless, and more likely to flake off the canvas in the latter case. Many paints don't need anything to be added to them in order to work - there's enough oil in the tube already.
I have an e-book on Amazon Kindle store which isn't going to impoverish you or make me rich so I don't feel much reluctance about mentioning it: it's called Oil Paint Basics, and covers all of this and more, although I don't go into much detail about stand oil: there was a good article though on the Michael Harding site - he makes oil paint, and if you look for it you should be able to find his views on the heavier oils and how to use them..
http://www.isleofwightlandscapes.net
http://www.wightpaint.blogspot.co.uk
Edited
by RobertJones
Posted
The Ampersand surfaces seem to suck less life out of the paint.
As for the amount of oil in it - well that does depend on the brand, and on the colour. Some paints are swimming in oil (and some need more oil to make them workable: those still using Alizarin Crimson will find it's very heavy on the oil, for instance, and there are others of equal gloop). But as a very general statement, I agree with Hedgehog and friend - there's often no need to add more oil, certainly don't just for the sake of it, and Turps may be all you need - but: I don't recommend just using mineral spirits in anything above the bottom layer; if you have a combination of "thirsty" canvas and underbound paint, you end up with something the consistency of toothpaste.
You can of course also use water-mixable oils, but we've been there before - it's a different set of issues.
http://www.isleofwightlandscapes.net
http://www.wightpaint.blogspot.co.uk
Posted
Liquin's good for glazing - I'm less than keen on it as a normal choice of medium.
I wouldn't have come back yet again, but the "uneven patches" thing struck a chord - oil paint dries over a very long period, and carries on changing long after it's surface-dry. That's one very good reason not to use a varnish too soon: some say not before 6 months, I prefer to wait for a year. I might oil out sooner - ie, apply a very THIN layer of, eg, oil painting medium to the painting to even out the dull and shinier spots, but also because it helps to bring out the colour. Adele's point has me wondering what the effect of applying an overall coat of Liquin would be - my feeling is that it might be a little rigid, as in inflexible; it's an alkyd medium, and I wonder how thickly painted oil would behave underneath it.
I wonder Adele if you have any older paintings on which you used this technique, and how they're bearing up now? The manufacturers don't, I think, recommend this use of it, and I don't think I would either - I've never tried it though, so have nothing other than my sense of caution to base an opinion on.
http://www.isleofwightlandscapes.net
http://www.wightpaint.blogspot.co.uk
Posted
I never coated a fresh painted work with Liquin - I waited 3 months or more, put a thin coat on and then waited another 3 months or so to varnish. There were two pieces of advice an art "expert" gave in reply to the problem of uneven surfaces - one was to use a brush and a thin glaze of liquin and the other was to use a cloth and stand or linseed oil, can't remember which, and apply it on the dried surface. I didn't like the second solution as it took ages to dry so opted for the liquin. It worked a treat. I still have some paintings treated like that and they are fine.
Posted
Try Winsor and Newton oil painting medium - it's oil plus spirits so won't de-nature your paint as mineral spirits alone will. OMS (of course I should have realized what that meant!) is very strong stuff, it doesn't have the resinous characteristic of Turpentine, and even a tiny quantity will make the paint as thin as water and about as viscous.
http://www.isleofwightlandscapes.net
http://www.wightpaint.blogspot.co.uk
Posted
I asked a user of the Winsor and Newton Artisan brand if they had also used Cobra oils; the answer was that the two brands behave in much the same way, but perhaps Cobra had the edge in explaining the technical characteristics of the paint; in terms of use, that isn't of course going to make much difference.
The usual argument against water-solubles is that they don't have the intensity of colour of regular oil paint, and as they're a fraction of the price of artists' quality (ie, premium-grade) oil paint, which employs metallic-based colours, this must make sense. In terms of health and ease of clearing up afterwards, of course they have big advantages - but their pigmentation strength is an issue. We don't know either how they're going to bear up in the long term: I'm not a scientist of any description, and simply don't know; theoretically, there's no obvious reason why they shouldn't behave perfectly well and age as regular oil paint does, hardening slowly, becoming somewhat more transparent, responding to time like regular paint. But we'll have to see - well, I won't, because I don't anticipate being around, or taking much of an interest, in 50 years' time. But others will.
While it may be useful to be aware of water soluble oils, I don't think it's quite so helpful to suggest that they're no different from regular oil paints. They have no more replaced regular oils than Alkyds have done, which also have their devotees. However, when I can I'm planning on buying a set of water-solubles so I can give them a real work-out of my own (you could always buy a set for me -- hallo..? Anyone?) - I'd really like to know what they feel like and how they respond in my hands, because we all respond to materials differently. So far, I've only painted a very small oil with a sample given to me - Grumbacher's, an American brand, rather than the ones we've talked about on POL or that Steve Strode used - and that was a very small sample indeed; and I have used Artisan oils, but only with other, regular oil paint. And that's no fair test. When I do, I'll post an opinion.... I do wish sample sets didn't always include black, though, for which I've almost no use at all..
http://www.isleofwightlandscapes.net
http://www.wightpaint.blogspot.co.uk