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Pen drawing
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Message
Posted
I drew this bird using a fineliner, going to add some watercolour to it.
I was wondering if anyone more experienced could give some advice on using less ink.
If you could copy the drawing and show me how you would do it with the whole less is more mantra in mind?
Happy new year to you all too :-)
Posted
I doubt very much that I shall get round to actually doing this, but one way you could would be to use wash instead of ink - which might be dilute Chinese ink, or Lamp Black watercolour. Then you could use the ink just for the construction lines, and the wash for the shading. (You could use acrylic ink; or even traditional Indian ink, but I find the latter harder to control.)
But I rather like it as it is: just buy more Fineliners (ensuring they're waterproof if you're planning on adding watercolour).
I've never been entirely convinced by the whole "less is more" schtick, but that's another argument.
Posted
It's all a matter of personal preference - I like the sketch-book drawing too, by the way - but as it happens I like densely worked ink and charcoal drawings; I suppose therefore that I like what others call overworking. I am not one to strive for greater simplicity under the impression that this conduces to greater beauty or harmony .... perhaps those things aren't really what I'm looking for. But then, I have my blind spots......
I would be inclined towards doing this in sepia, or brown madder - a darkish brown with a bit of oomph in it; or in simply lamp black. Or all three......
Posted
I also like it as it is, a nice simple pen drawing. But you asked a question.
Being the messy soul I am and not wanting a correct ornothological drawing/painting I would use some very dilute colour ink / water colour no matter, then I would use a largish brush and add some lights and then some darker washes and let them run into one another , it dosent matter if it runs over from Mr Birdie to branch and surround ...let it. Then instead of the controlled splodges you have used a few dry brush spotty bits just used with restraint , an old tooth brush is great for this. As mentioned previous;y sepias and soft ochres and browns. Personally I dont like that strident blue you have used. Its a wee hidden bird in a tangle of brambles and leaves.
Posted
I like this much more than the blue version - though I know you were just experimenting with colour washes in that one - even though now you've got colour, I'd like a bit on the bird too...... I did draw this out, by the way ..... or a version of same. Meant to apply a Lamp Black wash but haven't done it yet. I'm getting lazy now I've retired. I may pop it on here in a day or three!
Posted
You've posted a nice well-proportioned sketch Thomas. Not quite sure what you mean by using 'less ink'- I don't think that is a major concern. You've made a good start but adding a spotty background is not the way forward.
I assume you were working from a photograph and the trouble with photographs it that they lead to tight drawing which is not expressive. Birds are lively creatures always on the move so expressive line work is needed.
This sketchbook study was made with a Pentel Brush Pen and the tinting was made with a Pentel Colour Brush. The contour is broken - drawn quickly with lightly drawn 'search' lines. The late John Busby has published two books 'Drawing Birds' and 'Looking at Birds' do try to get hold of them.
I've just put a selection of sketchbook drawings on my Blog that might be of interest. www.rkstudio.blogspot.com
This sketchbook study was made with a Pentel Brush Pen and the tinting was made with a Pentel Colour Brush. The contour is broken - drawn quickly with lightly drawn 'search' lines. The late John Busby has published two books 'Drawing Birds' and 'Looking at Birds' do try to get hold of them.
I've just put a selection of sketchbook drawings on my Blog that might be of interest. www.rkstudio.blogspot.com
Edited
by robK2
Posted
This regular keeps posting to try to keep the place awake and a going concern - but I agree that the same names keep cropping up; on the other hand if they didn't, I'm not sure anyone else's would.
I've scanned my quick drawing - it's your bird, basically, because I'm not sure what species it is and have just copied with a fine liner (honesty prevails - there was a quick bit of pencil work first, I'm not used to drawing birds) and a touch or two of lamp black. Couldn't get much simpler - I don't suppose the scan will be brilliant, I've just done it because I felt the weight of your challenge and thought I'd better had..... You see you're in no danger of serious competition from me.
Rats now - I could do you a lovely rat........!
Posted
Yes, it was as simple as I could get it - too simple of course for any serious drawing, it being neither one thing nor the other, neither a spontaneous sketch to catch a movement nor an especially accurate drawing of any specific bird.
You were expecting oil? Hoo yes? A bit of ink not good enough for you, eh? Actually, oil would have been a lot easier, it's basic line drawing I find harder than I did, what with being a bit short sighted; and old; and not having one of Amanda's nice new pens. I don't draw enough - must do more: you have inspired me to a New Year's Resolution, to add to my Keep Off Facebook decision.
Posted
This is a VERY quick sketch I did some years ago in Kenya sitting on the edge of the lake . About one or two minutes. I think the best way to be completley loose and uninhibited is to just go for it. No detail just a very quick impression . I also use a biggish brush and just let it all "happen " 
I am not a detailed painter/ drawer of birds and leave that to the real experts ...Angleseys Charles Tunnicliffe .
Incidentally Rob K2 if the persistant pain in the butt posters on this site were not so persistant ,the forum would turn up its toes and die.........
I am not a detailed painter/ drawer of birds and leave that to the real experts ...Angleseys Charles Tunnicliffe .
Incidentally Rob K2 if the persistant pain in the butt posters on this site were not so persistant ,the forum would turn up its toes and die.........Edited
by North Light
Posted
Sylvia I doubt if intrusive posts by many persistent regulars contribute much of value to Forum discussions . It would be better if they stayed away rather than comment on aspects of drawing they do not practice regularly. Your post on this occasion has been an interruption It's an arrogant assumption that the Forum would die without yours and other 'regulars' frequent posts
Thomas I was hoping to have further discussion with you on 'using les sink'. I agree that with 'Pen and Wash' there is a danger that the line work becomes intrusive. There are ways of getting round the problem by using dilute ink whether Black or Sepia (this colour is no longer made from the Cuttlefiisn!). An artist that might help you is Sir Hugh Casson I've taken the above example from the web where you can see others.
Incidentally you mentioned Hans Holbein – he was a great draughtsman and a good artist to study if you are taking up life drawing – keep in touch I'd like to see your life drawings.Edited
by robK2
Posted
That Kenyan drawing was done so very quickly a real "now " go for it moment. I use a very small watercolour paint box on my trips abroad mainly for ease of use and carrying fallibility .
Suggestion go for it ,timing yourself e g three minutes . That way you will get a lovely freedom. Of course you can just do it your own way, your sketches are lovely and very often other peoples input isnt really required.
Posted
OK, here's my version of Thomas' drawing. I don't usually like to work from "secondhand" sources, but you did issue a direct challenge to me...
But first, some words. How to use less ink in preparation for a wash? Don't shade. Not at all. (I did shade the tail; if I was adding a wash I'd have to work around that or start again. I also shaded the eye. This could be okay as it's almost certainly the darkest thing and I might want it to be - er - Senegal blue). Minimal outlines are the thing - and it isn't a colouring book, so the lines don't have to join up. In fact, it can be more expressive if they don't.
On the subject of expressive lines... fineliners *might* not be the tool for the job. While that wasn't your question, it could be part of the answer. If your lines vary in width, they are more organic-looking and more interesting. A broader line can indicate weight, or hint at shade.
If you're planning on adding a wash of watercolour, you should be certain that your ink will stay put, i.e. that it is waterproof. The only fineliners that I have are not waterproof. The acrylate-based ink that I used in the following drawing, with a dip pen, is.
My drawing isn't very accurate, but I don't think, for this purpose, that it matters. It's a bit scruffy but it took ten minutes, so that's what you get.
And finally... I probably used more ink than you did.
The pen that I used is illustrated. It's a peculiar leaf shape thing that I got in a job lot of eBay. Nice and flexible and seems quite sturdy. No idea what it's called. Oh, and I used a splash of hastily applied water to dilute the colour on the pen.
The pen that I used is illustrated. It's a peculiar leaf shape thing that I got in a job lot of eBay. Nice and flexible and seems quite sturdy. No idea what it's called. Oh, and I used a splash of hastily applied water to dilute the colour on the pen.
Edited
by Amanda
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